phineasandferbfandomcom-20200223-history
Forum:Couple Name Redirects
There has been a dispute as of late about whether or not to include redirects for couple names to relationship pages. please read the below debate. please note that this is a 100% unaltered transfer from Bowser's and RRabbit42's talk pages in chronological order. Shipping redirects All 43 redirects have been deleted. We do not need 40+ redirects for every possible shipping combination of Ferb/Gretchen, Ferb/Vanessa, etc. This is not a shipping wiki. It is an encyclopedia of the show that happens to have a little shipping in it. — RRabbit42 (leave a message) 07:28, February 16, 2010 (UTC) this is a encyclopedia. however, not everyone from the internet who stumbles upon this wiki as i once did will know what to search to find the relationship pages. that's why the redirects were set up. [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 08:57, February 16, 2010 (UTC) :I must say, including the single redirect wouldn't work very well when have only a single relationship page. Maybe incorparating them when we have more than one (such as "Ferb's Relationship with Vanessa") amongst others. Even then, we'd need to make sure we perform it properly unless we want to add additional fire to the shipping wars which are going on at the moment. SomeoneD 09:06, February 16, 2010 (UTC) ::Where specifically are shipping wars happening at the moment??? [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 09:08, February 16, 2010 (UTC) :::Your blog is one main point of them, as the topic is getting spammed and taking up about 60% of any and all edits within the Wiki. Not trying to defame or flame anyone participating, but it's getting out of hand. SomeoneD ::::Dudes no offense to either of you but is spamming the head honcho's talk page really any better than those other blog comments you say are taking up the recent edit and other guy just buck up and accept that they don't want those redirect things and their in charge here :::::Anonymous: first off, i must politely tell you that this is none of your business. second, RRabbit is not "in charge". nobody is. in fact, i believe i'm quoting a help page somewhere when saying that he, Ardi, Topher, and the Flash just have a few extra buttons and can be trusted to use them. :::::SomeoneD: Actually, ther's no spam whatsoever on my shipping blog. I know, because I'm in charge of said blog and monitor it regularly. everything that's there is pertinent. [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 09:39, February 16, 2010 (UTC) (resetting indentation) Administrators also help guide the direction the wiki takes. I am very active on this wiki, but I do not consider myself the head honcho. Topher and I work together to address issues that come up. Flash is also a part of this, but at the moment, he and Ardi are less active because they probably attending to real life situations outside this wiki. — RRabbit42 (leave a message) 16:37, February 16, 2010 (UTC) Clarification Most character pages have a section that describes their interaction with other characters: the Relationship section. This section is supposed to be a short, objective description of the interaction, with a few examples. However, the Relationship section on Isabella's page grew large enough that we had to split most of it off into a separate page (Isabella and Phineas's relationship). Puppy love is the primary reason Isabella hangs around Phineas. This is an established fact in the show. About half of the Isabella and Phineas's relationship page deals with it. This is different than shipping. Shipping is a fan's interpretation of the relationship between two characters, usually with a romantic connection between the two. We have not created them, but in the future we may have father-daughter relationship pages (Lawrence-Candace, Heinz-Vanessa), mother-daughter relationship pages (Linda-Candace), et cetera. Those will not be shipping pages because in most societies, a romantic connection between parent and child is not permitted. It has not been seen in the show and Disney Channel is unlikely to breach that taboo, especially since this is a children's cartoon. So, to clarify what I mean when I say "this is not a shipping wiki": # Shipping currently takes place in blogs. It is permitted because it is a person's opinion and blogs are the appropriate place for opinion. # The main part of the wiki where the character and episode pages are needs to be objective and factual. We want this to be like an encyclopedia. # The Isabella and Phineas's relationship page does have information in it that can be considered shipping, but since that information is an established fact in the show, it takes priority over shipping. By creating redirects to handle shippings, technically that means this wiki endorses shipping. That is not the case and that is why they were deleted. — RRabbit42 (leave a message) 16:37, February 16, 2010 (UTC) but... I don't think that that's the case. i think all that redirects are are just tools to broaden the scale of people who can find what they're looking for. like, say i'm just a person from the internet who's never heard of wikis before but stumbles upon this one. okay, so now i type in Phinabella into the searchbar. now, the difference between weather i find what i'm looking for or not depends on redirects. do we really want to shun random internet people who've never heard of our Naming Convention Policy? if you want this to be like a encyclopedia, you have to assume that relatively nobody knows about the ban on couple name pages that this wiki has. that's why redirects are not just important, but necessary to our ability to be an encyclopedia. obviously most of the people who know our policies can't use this wiki as an encyclopedia because they're already rabid P&F fans (not unlike myself) and know everything about the show. to be a true encyclopedia with the kind of audience that we desire, we must redirect what people call things to what they are officially called. because, there is a difference in 99/100 cases. it is not a statement of endorsement. it is not declaring ourselves another counterpart to the Phinabella Wiki or the Ferbnessa and Feretchen Wiki. it is providing ourselves with a way for people who are used to couple names to find what they're looking for. [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 07:43, February 17, 2010 (UTC) :But no one has ever used any of the names you created re-directs for. Any new fan would quickly become used to the "Phinbella/Phinabella/Phinebella" names just from their sheer use ::Exactly! We don't even have redirects for those anymore! [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 08:27, February 17, 2010 (UTC) Comment here to continue the discussion. You see?! nobody will find what they're looking for!!! [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 08:47, February 17, 2010 (UTC) :@SomeoneD it doesn't matter why the page was created, it just matters if everyone can find what they're looking for. [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 13:36, February 17, 2010 (UTC) :: The reason all the redirects were deleted was because you went overboard with this idea, Bowser. Literally, there were 43 different variations of Phineas/Isabella that you created. I didn't want this to balloon to several hundred redirects if we started adding all possible variations of Jeremy/Candace, Jeremy/Vanessa, Jeremy/Stacy, Ferb/Gretchen, Ferb/Vanessa, Ferb/Holly, Phineas/Holly, Phineas/Gretchen, Phineas/Milly, Phineas/Vanessa, Linda/Lawrence, Linda/Heinz, Linda/Danny, Linda/Swampy, Linda/Bobbi, Lawrence/Charlene, Stacy/Coltrane, Baljeet/Isabella, Baljeet/Gretchen, Baljeet/Holly and whatever other couples people might come up with. Some of these have not even been hinted at in the series, but I want to show exactly how far this could expand if we let it get out of control. :: The purpose of an Index in a book or redirects on this wiki is to provide a few, common alternate ways of finding information. Putting every possible variation on a subject works against that idea. If you can scale the couple redirects back to a reasonable number, then I can support this. I would say that no more than 5 redirects should be enough for people to find the relationship page for a given couple. — RRabbit42 (leave a message) 17:07, March 9, 2010 (UTC) Just a general FYI: as per the Wikia Help page, "Votes are registered under either your username or, if you're not logged in, your IP address. This means that it is easy to manipulate the results, and the poll feature should not be used for important purposes." It also means that polls are not the preferred method of conducting community business like this. Polls should be used to get a general idea of what people think about a subject. But, you've got a voting section here, so we're covered. — RRabbit42 (leave a message) 16:35, March 9, 2010 (UTC) Support or oppose here *'Extremely strong support': I genuinely believe that it can only make our relationship pages more accessible to include shipping and couple name redirects. [[User:Bowser101|'~Bowserstar']] Talk to the new leader of ThunderClan 08:47, February 17, 2010 (UTC) * Support (conditional): I feel that the redirects may actually work in a helpful manner, provided we establish one or two redirects at most per couple. Including almost every possible variation would be both an incredible mess and nearly impossible (due to the number of potential versions). * Support (tentative): see "Comment here to continue the discussion" above. — RRabbit42 (leave a message) 17:08, March 9, 2010 (UTC) Vote! should we have couple name redirects? yes no neutral The redirects have not been reinstated and the main proponent of adding shipping to this wiki (Bowser101) has not been back on over half a year. This issue is closed. Couple